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#2593320 - 05/26/11 09:02 AM
Sea-Foam in Engine Oil?
Ice_Fishin07 Offline
HSOShow.com Family

Registered: 01/20/11
Posts: 161
Loc: MN
It might be dumb question. But I never thought about adding sea-foam to engine oil, yesterday when I added sea-foam to fuel of my 2003 accord, I read the can. The can says you can add sea-foam to Crankcase oil for cleaning. Now my dumb question is: Is the crankcase oil is same as engine oil? Is it safe to add sea-foam to the engine oil for some time before I change oil? How many miles do you run the car with sea-foam in engine oil/ or just park and let the car run for 10-15 minutes before oil change? Does sea-foam in engine oil help the car?
Thanks!
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#2593334 - 05/26/11 09:14 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Ice_Fishin07]
Jeremy airjer W Offline

HotSpotOutdoors Pro Staff

Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 9394
Loc: Mt. Iron/St. paul (deranged)
You can add half the can to the oil and drive it. I like to change the oil after 20-50 miles. You can then add the other half to the new oil and drive it until the next oil change.

Sea foam works great for freeing up noisy hydraulic litters. Your Honda does not have them. It is also a pretty good oil system cleaner but is really not necessary on a properly maintained engine.

It is also a fantastic intake and valve cleaner. With the engine hot disconnect a vacuum hose that routes into the intake as close to the throttle body as possible. With the engine running slowly add sea foam into the vacuum hose just enough to make the engine run a little ruff but not enough to make the engine stall. When the can is just about empty add enough to make he engine stall and let it soak or 10-20 minutes. Restart the engine and drive.

It's also a fantastic penetrating lube. Deep Creep is the aerosol version of deadpan motor tune and can be used as a penetrating lube, decarbonizer, fogging oil, starting fluid, etc.

Owner - Half Empty Graphic Design
ASE Certified Automotive Technician - Paramount Auto Service, Hastings Goodyear
13 year member of Hot Spot Outdoors, 1/17/01 - 1/17/14...........thecarguy@q.com
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#2599301 - 06/06/11 11:25 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Jeremy airjer W]
BoxMN Offline
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 4926
Loc: WBL, MN & Crosslake weekender
Airjer, in my 98 k1500 with 5.7 I just had what I think is a sticky lifter (?) start to make noise. It goes away after warmup. I have not been driving this turck that much lately, but it is a new "sound".

My neighbor (Cat mechanic) had me dump half a can of Seafoam and some ATF in. He said this will clean it it if just "sticky" or dirty, with any luck. He said change oil after about 1000 of highway or "at-temp" driving. Does this sound correct to you? Not really doubting my neighbor (he helped do intake in 3.1 among other things) but have not heard of ATF in oil before.

Thanks for your thoughts.


Edited by BoxMN (06/06/11 11:26 AM)

-Box
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#2599340 - 06/06/11 12:11 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: BoxMN]
Jeremy airjer W Offline

HotSpotOutdoors Pro Staff

Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 9394
Loc: Mt. Iron/St. paul (deranged)
How much ATF?

I'm not a big fan of ATF in the oil. ATF is typically straight 30w oil. But it has a pretty aggressive detergent package along with the other additives it has in it. I'd run it until the noise goes away. Then change the oil. Then add another 1/2 can seafoam to the oil and drive it until the next oil change.

Owner - Half Empty Graphic Design
ASE Certified Automotive Technician - Paramount Auto Service, Hastings Goodyear
13 year member of Hot Spot Outdoors, 1/17/01 - 1/17/14...........thecarguy@q.com
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#2599466 - 06/06/11 03:36 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: BoxMN]
Macgyver55 Online   content
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 12/10/04
Posts: 3901
Loc: Coon Rapids, Mn.
Without hearing the noise its tough to say, but a cracked exhaust manifold or broken exhaust manifold stud could be a possibility too. They'll sometimes make a ticking sound until warm.
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#2600003 - 06/07/11 12:56 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Macgyver55]
BoxMN Offline
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 4926
Loc: WBL, MN & Crosslake weekender
Thanks guys. I put about 1/3 quart ATF in.

I was thinking about exhaust as it kinda sounds like from the rear of engine, or under it, but I am no mechanic! ha! So not sure. It did go away within 10-20 seconds of adding the Seafoam/ATF so was thinking lifter.

-Box
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#2601507 - 06/09/11 04:10 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: BoxMN]
theoilman Offline
Sr HotSpotOutdoors.com Family

Registered: 10/12/06
Posts: 650
Loc: Florida
Some of the comments in this thread really scare me!!!!!
1. Airjer, ATF (Dex III, Mercon, ATF+4 and some others are a 20W-20 when transposing to the engine oil scale. The new low viscosity fluids (Dex IV, Mercon LV, Toyota WS) are between a 10 and 20, slightly thinner.

ATF used as a cleaner added to engine oil is really old school - 40 years or more. It just doesn't have the additives that engine oil needs and may harm the engine, though many have used it this way for many years. Left in for very long will cause harm with excess wear.

Anything as thin as Seafoam when added to engine oil is going to drastically reduce the oil's viscosity (even 1/2 can in 5 quarts is substantial), and will greatly reduce the film strength and protection causing greatly increased wear.

Almost all engine oil cleaners / flush products have very similar instructions. Many are now pint size bottles (1/2 quart), with the engine warmed up ahead of time, shut it off, add the cleaner, run at idle for 15 to 30 minutes DO NOT DRIVE THE VEHICLE, immediately shut the engine off, drain and change oil and filter as a normal oil change. All the reputable engine cleaners/flush product companies know that the reduced viscosity combination will cause high wear if you run the engine under load!

My recommendation, AMSOIL Engine and Transmission Flush. It is a detergent based product, not a solvent based one. Follow the instructions on the bottle carefully!

Don Dawson, AMSOIL Dealer
e-mail dondawson@the-oilman.com
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#2601750 - 06/09/11 10:16 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: theoilman]
Jeremy airjer W Offline

HotSpotOutdoors Pro Staff

Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 9394
Loc: Mt. Iron/St. paul (deranged)
Quote:
Anything as thin as Seafoam when added to engine oil is going to drastically reduce the oil's viscosity (even 1/2 can in 5 quarts is substantial), and will greatly reduce the film strength and protection causing greatly increased wear.


Once the naphtha and isopropynol flash off your left with pale oil. It can't be that bad?

If your engine is at the point where you need to use it I think the "greatly increased wear" has long come and gone and the least of your worries!

I've lost count of how many tines I have used it successfully to solve issues. I have used it in every combination you could think of in my vehicles, customers vehicles, and friends and family vehicles. I have yet to come across any I'll effects that out way the bennefits of the problems it solves.

Its not just an oil treatment. It's a diagnostic tool, a fuel cleaner, a great decarbonizer, a fuel stabilizer, and a fantastic penetrant to name a few. It's a simple product that covers many bases very well and it's a Minnesota company to boot. I guess I could have a shelf full of half empty specific purpose products but I prefer having that trusty can of seafoam that's usually empty.

Owner - Half Empty Graphic Design
ASE Certified Automotive Technician - Paramount Auto Service, Hastings Goodyear
13 year member of Hot Spot Outdoors, 1/17/01 - 1/17/14...........thecarguy@q.com
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#2601756 - 06/09/11 10:26 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Jeremy airjer W]
Jeremy airjer W Offline

HotSpotOutdoors Pro Staff

Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 9394
Loc: Mt. Iron/St. paul (deranged)
Sea Foam® Motor Treatment may be used in an oil crankcase 2 separate ways, depending on your needs and expectations. Sea Foam® Motor Treatment is most commonly used as a pre-service, old oil residue re-liquefier / cleaner and moisture drier. It can also be used as an after-service oil additive. In either application, Sea Foam® Motor Treatment will safely and slowly re-liquefy old oil residue. Each method is described below:

As a pre service cleaner for old oil residue, sticky rings or valve train noise, pour 1 ˝ ounces of Sea Foam® Motor Treatment into the engine oil crankcase for EACH quart of oil capacity, including filter. Drive a MINIMUM of 30 minutes/miles, MAXIMUM 100 miles, and then do your oil change service – Lube, Oil & Filter (LOF). This begins the process of safely/slowly re liquefying the old oil residue so contaminants may flow and be filtered. This also makes your old oil dirtier, quickly, so a LOF service is necessary when the oil gets dirty. Great for Turbocharged & Supercharged applications where oils deteriorate so quickly due to heat, and leave those residues that NEED CLEANING.
As an after service additive into fresh oil, nearly fresh oil, or oil (used condition) that is NOT ready to be changed (based on mileage since last oil change), put the same amount of Sea Foam® Motor Treatment into the crankcase as described above, and then regularly monitor your oil for color and clarity. Set a predetermined schedule for checking the oil condition on a mileage, timed, or event basis (like every time you add fuel, etc.) to determine when an oil service is necessary. Monitoring of the oil for color and clarity will tell you when it is time to do an oil change service. NOTE: Do not exceed 3,000 miles without changing the oil.
Sea Foam® is safe to use with all synthetic oils. 100% synthetic oils, and blends of synthetic and petroleum-based oils, were engineered and are manufactured to be 100% compatible with petroleum based oils, all brands, and vice/versa. Without this compatibility, oil manufacturers and engineers would be liable for the results of mixing non-compatible lubricants. Since Sea Foam® ONLY contains petroleum oils, it is entirely compatible with synthetic oils.

Owner - Half Empty Graphic Design
ASE Certified Automotive Technician - Paramount Auto Service, Hastings Goodyear
13 year member of Hot Spot Outdoors, 1/17/01 - 1/17/14...........thecarguy@q.com
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#2603382 - 06/13/11 02:17 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: BoxMN]
CaptainMusky Online   content
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4362
Loc: Central MN
Originally Posted By: BoxMN
Airjer, in my 98 k1500 with 5.7 I just had what I think is a sticky lifter (?) start to make noise. It goes away after warmup. I have not been driving this turck that much lately, but it is a new "sound".

My neighbor (Cat mechanic) had me dump half a can of Seafoam and some ATF in. He said this will clean it it if just "sticky" or dirty, with any luck. He said change oil after about 1000 of highway or "at-temp" driving. Does this sound correct to you? Not really doubting my neighbor (he helped do intake in 3.1 among other things) but have not heard of ATF in oil before.

Thanks for your thoughts.
Box, I will say with almost 100% certainty not even hearing your engine that what you are hearing is "piston slap". It is a common thing with that motor and the new 5.3. It is caused by the emissions standards changing and the companies going to a shorter piston skirt (or so I have been told). I have had countless GM engines from the 5.7 like you's to the 5.3, 3.1, etc and they have all done this. I have 213,000 miles on mine and it still does it. I have been told that it doesnt decrease the life of the mmotor, but replacing pistons and rings does not make it better necessarily.
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#2603647 - 06/13/11 10:04 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: CaptainMusky]
Jeremy airjer W Offline

HotSpotOutdoors Pro Staff

Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 9394
Loc: Mt. Iron/St. paul (deranged)
Piston slap, my Honda and three three Toyotas have all had it.

Normally I only hear it in the winter on cold start up.

The best way to describe I't is it's more of a hollow sound. A lifter tick will be a sharper more pronounced tick. The difference in the two are very distinguishable.

Owner - Half Empty Graphic Design
ASE Certified Automotive Technician - Paramount Auto Service, Hastings Goodyear
13 year member of Hot Spot Outdoors, 1/17/01 - 1/17/14...........thecarguy@q.com
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#2604030 - 06/14/11 01:53 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Jeremy airjer W]
BoxMN Offline
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 4926
Loc: WBL, MN & Crosslake weekender
This just started. I know I have heard it beofre in many vehicles, it is just that is new in this one. I have not heard it before. I just changed oil, and I can tell there was some pretty sludgy carp in it, mainly noticed it from the oil drained from the filter. I added added about a half can (maybe a bit less) Seafoan again, and (if it matters) used penzoil with extra "cleaning agent" oil. I will change again in about 3000 miles and try to notice if the sound fades or stays that way.

I am not really worried, just want to try to do anything I can, if anything, to help get more miles. I follow you on the piston slap, but I can't tell the difference with my limited experience in sounds smile thanks all for info. I'll pop in this thread later and give an update on my sound...


Edited by BoxMN (06/14/11 01:54 PM)

-Box
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#2604191 - 06/14/11 07:25 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: BoxMN]
Jeremy airjer W Offline

HotSpotOutdoors Pro Staff

Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 9394
Loc: Mt. Iron/St. paul (deranged)
not a big fan of pensoil, for some reason.

Owner - Half Empty Graphic Design
ASE Certified Automotive Technician - Paramount Auto Service, Hastings Goodyear
13 year member of Hot Spot Outdoors, 1/17/01 - 1/17/14...........thecarguy@q.com
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#2604235 - 06/14/11 09:05 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Jeremy airjer W]
1968 Offline
HSOShow.com Family

Registered: 12/28/07
Posts: 142
Loc: twin cities
I would never routinely put it in my oil. Only if I was trying to remedy some very poor maintenance. Even then, disturbing sludge can be a tricky thing. Move enough at once and you could plug your oil pumps inlet screen.

Best thing is timely maintenance, even better would be with synthetic oil.

Additives added to the oil are generally frowned upon by most, if not all manufacturers. Quality oil already has all the additives it needs.

Seafoam is also up to 10 bucks now. One can of it plus regular oil and you could have had syn and extended your interval.
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#2604304 - 06/15/11 05:28 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: 1968]
Ufatz Online   content
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/28/04
Posts: 3571
Loc: Extreme NW MN
Interesting. You advocate synthetic oil (much more expensive) but then also point out that "....engine oils have everything they need and car makers do not advocate additives."
I have always felt the synthetic oil thing is greatly over done and that a couple of "high end" and highly advertised additives are at best simply benign and useless.
A good quality motor oil, changed regularly, will run most engines until the day they go to the boneyard. So why spend the extra money?
Mainly because you have become a victim of advertising!!
But hey!......it's YOUR money.
Oh...and SeaFoam should sell for about $1.00 a pint.

If chief Joseph had really said all he is alleged to have said he would have had no time to be chief.
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#2604473 - 06/15/11 09:35 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Ufatz]
Jeremy airjer W Offline

HotSpotOutdoors Pro Staff

Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 9394
Loc: Mt. Iron/St. paul (deranged)
Just because you use synthetic does not mean you can extend your service interval.

We are talking about neglected, tired or engines that are showing there age. Is synthetic going to last longer? No way!


Edited by airjer (06/15/11 09:37 AM)

Owner - Half Empty Graphic Design
ASE Certified Automotive Technician - Paramount Auto Service, Hastings Goodyear
13 year member of Hot Spot Outdoors, 1/17/01 - 1/17/14...........thecarguy@q.com
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#2605647 - 06/16/11 09:45 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Jeremy airjer W]
1968 Offline
HSOShow.com Family

Registered: 12/28/07
Posts: 142
Loc: twin cities
Sorry if I stepped on any toes here. I never said seafoam isn't a fine product, just that I wouldn't put it in the engine oil routinely. ONLY if I was desludging. Even then I usually only do it if it's the last chance for the oil rings to free up and do their job. If your car is under warranty I would really think twice before pouring it in the crankcase.

Ufatz- I guess you haven't bought any in quite some time. Current Seafoam price at Oreilly's

Airjer- Obviously if the engine is already in bad shape, syn isn't going to perform any miracles. Engines do run cleaner when used. I have no doubt it can extend vehicle life when used throughout the driveline. Cold weather performance is another plus, marginal mileage gains thru reduced friction, and yes extended intervals. What's not to like? Being a required fluid is getting more popular every day too, as I'm sure you are well aware of.

Excellent for boat trailer bearings too. Haven't lost a boat trailer bearing to rust etching since switching to Mobil 1. Amsoil looks to have some excellent greases too. Go to their website and view their "pound out" test. Impressive.

Don't forget about two strokes! That's where syn can be really felt and smelt(not). I noticed an immediate power increase when I switched on my then 5 year old sled and is still going strong for 10 more now.

Finally, I would never go by a cars own oil life monitor without syn or at least a used oil analysis to confirm damage isn't happening with reg oil and your interval. I've seen dash light schdules produce oil that stinks super bad and will tattoo you for the day if you get it on your skin.

Good night!
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#2605698 - 06/17/11 05:11 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: 1968]
Ufatz Online   content
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/28/04
Posts: 3571
Loc: Extreme NW MN
Hey 1968........please note, I said Sea Foam "should sell for $1 a pint"...not that that was the current selling price. It probably costs 50-cents to make a gallon of it! Ha! Like cheap booze.

If chief Joseph had really said all he is alleged to have said he would have had no time to be chief.
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#2605715 - 06/17/11 06:17 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Ufatz]
RiverFish Offline
HotSpotOutdoors Specialist

Registered: 01/30/08
Posts: 1396
Loc: Central, WI
Seafoam $6.50 a bottle at our local Menards.

Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.
Henry David Thoreau
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#2605740 - 06/17/11 07:14 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: RiverFish]
CaptainMusky Online   content
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4362
Loc: Central MN
Part of what causes piston slap is carbon buildup on the piston skirt. You can use cleaners until you are blue in the face and I dont think you will ever get rid of this sound especially on cold winter startup.
My 5.3 has 213,000 miles on it now. Runs great other than the sound of marbles rolling around a 50 gallon metal drum when I start it. Well, its not that bad, but I know its piston slap because every vehicle I have owned since 1996 has done at some point in its life.
Some oils seem to make it less noticeable. Castrol GTX is the best that I have found. Also, getting away from using those crappy fram filters and using a WIX has made a difference. Much better filtering capacity. If you have ever seen a WIX and a Fram cut open, you will never buy a Fram again. About half the filtering capacity. Sad.
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#2605861 - 06/17/11 09:31 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: CaptainMusky]
Jeremy airjer W Offline

HotSpotOutdoors Pro Staff

Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 9394
Loc: Mt. Iron/St. paul (deranged)
Originally Posted By: CaptainMusky
Part of what causes piston slap is carbon buildup on the piston skirt. You can use cleaners until you are blue in the face and I dont think you will ever get rid of this sound especially on cold winter startup.


?


My understanding of piston slap is there is a tolerance issue between the piston and the cylinder. Once the piston and cylinder warm up the tolerance tightens and the problem goes away.

Owner - Half Empty Graphic Design
ASE Certified Automotive Technician - Paramount Auto Service, Hastings Goodyear
13 year member of Hot Spot Outdoors, 1/17/01 - 1/17/14...........thecarguy@q.com
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#2606466 - 06/18/11 08:18 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Jeremy airjer W]
delcecchi Offline
HSO Legacy Member

Registered: 04/23/02
Posts: 11436
Loc: Rochester, MN/Wakemup Village
Isn't it that the piston is Aluminum and the cylinder is Iron, so there needs to be some extra space when cold since aluminum expands more than iron? And it is exacerbated by the oil that is normally on the cylinder walls when running having drained off?

Pin location and rod angle probably contributes as well.

Del

And it's all over now, Baby Blue.
Donate blood and save lives.




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#2606758 - 06/19/11 05:59 PM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: delcecchi]
Macgyver55 Online   content
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 12/10/04
Posts: 3901
Loc: Coon Rapids, Mn.
Originally Posted By: delcecchi
Isn't it that the piston is Aluminum and the cylinder is Iron, so there needs to be some extra space when cold since aluminum expands more than iron?

That is true, but this has been the case for many many years without piston slap.
I believe that the main cause of slap is a combination of shortening of piston skirts to reduce weight and rotational friction, and the raising of ring height on the piston for improved combustion. Older, longer skirted pistons had less ability to "rock" in the cylinder so the noise was not present. The shorter the skirt, the tighter the tolerance needs to be to prevent rocking of the piston. They may have gone too far in some instances but in most cases it is not detrimental to engine life.
As Jer said, once the engine warms a bit the tolerances tighten up and the slap fades away.

And, who doesn't like to see a shorter skirt? wink

You can lead, as long as you can keep up! smile

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#2622940 - 07/16/11 07:49 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Ufatz]
Whoaru99 Offline
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/29/02
Posts: 4519
Loc: Here, USA
Originally Posted By: Ufatz
Interesting. You advocate synthetic oil (much more expensive) but then also point out that "....engine oils have everything they need and car makers do not advocate additives."
I have always felt the synthetic oil thing is greatly over done and that a couple of "high end" and highly advertised additives are at best simply benign and useless.
A good quality motor oil, changed regularly, will run most engines until the day they go to the boneyard. So why spend the extra money?
Mainly because you have become a victim of advertising!!
But hey!......it's YOUR money.
Oh...and SeaFoam should sell for about $1.00 a pint.


I don't necessarily disagree, but I use synthetics in most of my vehicles. I change oil once per year and have gone up to 25,000 miles. My truck has >210,000 miles, basically uses no oil, runs as smooth as any, and there is no apparent goo or anything inside the oil fill cover and what can be seen through the valve cover hole all looks like normal metal, no black/brown gunk build up. Had the intake manifold off for a gasket leak at around 190K, I think, and it looked clean enough to me in the intake valley.

Can I say the same thing wouldn't be true running conventional oil? Nope, but I like the relatively low hassle of not changing oil every 3K like a lot of people still do.

Everyone has to decide if they perceive a benefit to synthetic oils and extended drain intervals. Based on my own experience so far I'll probably keep using them, naive as I am. wink

My current "experiment" is to run my Impala on conventional oil until the oil life monitor gets down to 5-10% then change it. Last change I think was about 4,500-5,000 miles at that point. 46K and counting so there's a long way to go yet before there is any anecdotal evidence of good/bad/

Just because there is a knob doesn't mean you should turn it.
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#2629712 - 07/25/11 11:53 AM
Re: Sea-Foam in Engine Oil? [Re: Whoaru99]
BoxMN Offline
Sr HSO Family

Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 4926
Loc: WBL, MN & Crosslake weekender
FWIW, in my 350 (190k) it was lifters, my neighbor knows the difference in sound, his old GTO has slap he says, and mine was definitely lifter.

After the first ATF and Sea Foam, it reduced significanlty the time it took to go away, and now have just half can on Seafoam and about 600 miles and the sound is totally gone upon startup. Going to change oil in 2400 miles and then try no sea foam and see if it starts again, or hopefully not. Good read here on the info you all give. thanks.

-Box
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